labatia

union is the best for a job right?? what are some places that are union?

imported_proof

Union is not always the best situation to be in but I have to say if ur in a good one , your laughing , as for who is unionized , it usually varies , most contactors are other then the privateers , alot of factories are , and alot of times the place may not even be a factory/ blue colar situation i. e office , comunications buildings but the blue colar workers employed buy the company i.e maintence , janitorial , sound and lighting or whatever else may be. these are just a few , I would say figure what you want to do and find a union that represents them and go from there not vice versa.

imported_gatherer

muahahahahahahahahaha hell no!!!!

unions stop you from personally advancing ... everything is based on senority so basically if you get a job in a union place you can't work your *** off and move up the ladder with the standard combination of hardwork and *** kissing (good skill to have) and some unions even delegate how "hard" you work if there are measureable standards (like number of nuts screwed onto bolts per hour) it'll be in the union book .. if you do less someone will grieve it if you do more someone will grieve it.... if you work fast and then relax for the rest fo the time someone will grieve the break...

I hate unions... also the fact that you have to pay union dues and you don't make your regular wages while on strike you lose money .. and most businesses now adays that have unions will have different unions in different places this is so that agreements are negociated at different times .. then they place an offer on the table slighty better then the current agreement but not keeping up with cost of living so the union walks your on strike not making much money and the company just up's the supply coming fromt he other work places to make up for the loss at your place. the result? they keep you out there... and then a few weeks down the road they put the same offer ont he table .. well all the dumbasses in the union accept the agreement why? because they are broke (not enough union strike pay) and have lots of bills to pay (lack of saving for themselves.) and bingo company gets what it wants and the worker is screwed... in the end it creates a barrier between managment and union and only serves to keep the members from doing what they want and going in their careers where they want to.

don't get me wrong when unions first came around they were a great Idea. they were great because they improved working conditions but this was because we didn't have laws to protect the worker we now do have laws and so the union is obsolete. when they first came out and you were being paid 10 cents an hour you didn't care if you were on strike for a year because you were already at rock bottom only way you could go is up

anyways I hope this helps ... at bell canada and bell mobility (bell canada is unionized bell mobility is not) the union gets paid less then non union and the non union get bonuses and incentives the union does not. the unioned guys pay dues the non union guys only pay tax. non union get chances for over time if they want it union guys cannot get overtime, ever.

you keep more of your money when your non union and can ask for a pay raise any time you want. these are the benifits of non union.

for comparasion since starting at bell mobility I currently make 16.5% more then what I did when I started... thats a comparasion of gross stated salary before benifits and overtime.

now this past year I made 115 % of my gross stated salary ... and thats because of overtime. I got 15% more then my stated salary... and all the overtime was volenteering for jobs I wasn't forced to be here (but I wouldn't get that extra cash )

I have worked in a union, I worked at dominion. there I was at the bottom of the heap for seniority. however I didn't know how unions worked so I busted my *** to impress my boss (I needed more hours of work) I've been grieved for working to hard and I've been grieved for getting more hours then the guys at the top. whoppie the boss would schedule them then have to call me in when they didn't sho. I hated wasting my time waiting for a phone call. I'd rather have myself scheduled beforehand.

anyways the dues sucked my money away I hated it. the union also signed a new agreement before I got there that separated the workers as well ... the older unionized guys got pay raises every 3 months where the new people had to work a certain number of hours... well the new guys couldn't get enough hours because of the old guys takeing them. which sucks *** took me 1 year to get a raise of 10 cents an hour... never again will I be unionized.

anyways I know that most bell (unionized) technicans have had their hours cut and stuff to avoid laying people off(bad press) but can you survive on minimum hours (at bell thats like 5 hours a week at dominion where I worked in a union it's 4 hours a week)

boy that was a big rant

imported_gatherer

well I haven't been on strike ever (as above I stated they are bad things)

but I have watched as a friend who was unionized was forced to strike (because they rejected the offer) for 6 weeks or so only then to have everyone accept the same offer in the end they got screwed even more when the management removed a shift...

well hey I "helped" him out a bit when that strike happened (I had a winfall from tax season) personally I haven't seen the "help" returned.... but hey I'm just glad he didn't get canned when they removed that shift.

anyways he knows who he is

Gallagher

union sucks man unless your a lazy ****

imported_gatherer

is this coming from a union guy??? are you in a union at canpar (or wherever you work)

Gallagher

yes, and I finally got those homo's that worked there fired !!!!! Now we got some actual workers that will work

Drewspeed

I've worked for both (Purolator=unionized) and now am working in a non-union environment.

There will always be a debate whether or not unions are good or bad. I don't believe unions are 100% necessary in today's society BUT the places that have unions these days would never be able to survive without them I believe. Can you see Canada Post or one of the Ford plants having non-unionized employees at this stage? No way.....

I'll be joining a unionized environment next month with the TTC. I've interviewed alot of unionized TTC people and overall they don't have major complaints.

Yes seniority is the biggest factor. Laziness does creep up when you do establish seniority but that's for their supervisors/management to deal with and not the lower level seniority people to complain about. Nothing usually gets resolved because the employee can file grievances and nothing ever gets proved......

You do your job = everyone happy.

In my current job (non-union) ***-kissing gets you nowhere (maybe because of slow IT industry right now) so I decided for the switch. I got into TTC because there will be tons of IT opportunities after I get in.

imported_gatherer

*** kissing and impressing the boss is what got me the raises stated above..

alos if the bosses say "I didn't know we could do that" you know your doing a good job... (and yes I work in IT)

anyways if you want to see what a non unionized car plant operates like look at Alliston at the honda plant I believe thats non unionized.

personally I think Canada post and Ford would be better off and more streamline if they didn't have unions. however once a union is in there they ussually make it part of the contract that only "unionized" people will be hired ... this allows them to keep a full supply of union grunts to walk out at negociation time.

if ford built a plant now and hired non unionized workers and paid them more then unionized workers at other plants the union grunts would walk out and shut ford down till ford hired only unionized people at union rates at the new plant ... which would then become another local...

personally I think thats unfair.

with the joining of all bell companies into what will be one large company the union for bell canada has started to apply pressure on BCE to hire only union workers at all bell places...

what this means is I would become unionized and have no say in the matter. which is just plain wrong...

also the fact that you need only 50% +1 vote to get a union in but to disband a union you need like 75% or so...

I don't see that as fair... down with unions... and you think bus drivers should be paid 50k+ to drive a bus for the TTC ... the TTC would actually make money if they could pay their employees what the job is worth.... (more like 30 to 40k if you ask me)

Mirai Trunks

dont know where u got the idea union jobs r the best?!

unions r only good for the lazy and for dead end jobs....and well maybe jobs that pay out good pensions heh

DJTre

Pharma-Plus is unionized, but shoppers drug mart is still better.

PULOVR

[

punkindrublic

i'm gonna be entering the millwright union of ontario hopefully in may.... weither its good or not i dont know.... but i start at $27/hr and full benefits.... compared to the crap i'm doing now that sounds pretty damn sweet.... when i become licenced i move to $37/hr..... which will put me higher then what my dad makes as a maintenence supervisor.... its all about the bling bling

Mirai Trunks

I said unions are good for dead end jobs...not that jobs that have unions ARE dead end jobs. I am not 100% against them or anything. Of course there is room for advancement...as with pretty much any job. I am actually more informed about unions and employee rights than most people that work in a union. My father has worked in one for my whole life and I have had a lot of education in that field. So please, don't say I am misinformed...because you are misinformed on what I know heh.

As for you knowing you would have your job back after an injury...that has really nothing to do with a union. It is Canadian law that you cannot be discharged because of injury. The job you held at the time of injury must be available to you when you are deemed fit to return.

There are positive aspects to unions such as job security, pensions, better wages etc. But, if you do any research into human resources, any job is very secure. You pretty much have to commit a criminal act for a company to be justified in firing you. In most cases though, people do not know their own rights as an employee. In that case, unions seem to be god sent.

IMO i think the people that are dead against unions are those that are misinformed/uneducated on the topic, or those who have worked in one and felt they were mistreated by the union(yes this does happen! shocking!). My major problem with them is the senority issue.

We are giving our opinion as did you, so dont be mad because someone thinks differently than you do.

SoccerNut

I am in the a union. Pipe trade union that is. I have been a plumber for 3 years now 2 of which were in a non union shop. Non union is ****! The pay sucks you get crap benefits and worst off no pension. In the union the pay is great the benefits are great and the pension is awesome. You guys know nothing about unions. Join before you speak. I will be making 45 bucks an hpur when I get my full license and for people to say there is no advancement.... well thats bull****! One of my friends is now head chairman of the union when he started as a plumber and I have a few other friends that are foreman now and runs jobs. You don't know what your talking about until you have been on both sides of the table. As for working are asses off...we do and we are far from LAZY!! So I would appreciate you get you facts straight before you call us lazy. If it wasn't for union plumbers you would have problems with plumbing everywhere. Mon union doesn't care if they do a good job but we do!! GET YOU FACTS STRAIGHT PEOPLE!!!

PULOVR

[

imported_gatherer

Pulovr,

just as a note... my comments are not from a "outsider" as you stated I have worked in a union job and compared with my non union jobs (not just bell mobility) I've gotten more from the non union job...

as I stated before the idea of unions and collective bargaining were very useful and a great Idea for raising the living standards and pay of the common worker and this was great when we didn't have laws to protect them...

however after being in a union and seeing how they protected the jobs of the lazy and incompetent, the ones that would do the minimum and no more. While at the Same time those that worked hard to "prove" themselves to the managers that they had what it took, don't get any extra hours ... why? because of seniority...

in a place like Dominion , where I worked, where a few people would just get the minimum number of hours, I didn't believe and I still don't believe that seniority should be used to determine who gets the most hours..

in collective bargaining the idea behind it orginally was to get everyone paid equally for the same type of work.... well I say if I can do job X and you can do job X why should you get 10 hours more per week then I do? (assuming you started at this company before me) that doesn't seem to fair to me .... we can both do job X

now lets say you also want to slack off a bit ... the managers can't simply give me 10 hours extra and cut back your hours because your not working at an acceptable rate... doesn't seem to fair from a company cost benifit stand point

and from that perspective it would be cheaper for a company to be non unionized keep it's employees happy with good equal pay and benifits and triming the fat when needed it removes inefficiencies...

now a unionized company whenever they have to trim fat where does it get trimed from? the top? those that have been there the longest? those that are laziest? hell no they trim from the bottom why? because a union protects from the oldest member (years of service) to the youngest .... you've been in the union the least they'll care about you the least.

Unions create a barrier between management and the workers ....which is never any good for company efficiencies... inefficient companies result in higher product pricing for the consumer....

CivicsRule,

I'm not calling all union workers lazy there are lots of people that work hard in unions...and have done so for years. what I am saying though is unions tie the hands of companies to prevent companies from triming the lazy, eventually they rise to the top of the seniority and stay there secure in there jobs...

all I'm saying is unions result in "over" security of a workers jobs these days and this "over security" of their job breeds laziness and low moral amongst the workers...

The time of needing unions for most jobs has past... fair compensation are given by companies no discrimination is allowed by law... look at walmart for example.... they don't have unions ..why? because they fairly compensate their worker. they give wage increases on a regualr basis and have stock options for their employees. in return they don't get stuck with inoperability from strikes and lost profitability.

I have sat on both sides of the fence ... I like it better non unionized simply because in all of my non unionized jobs I hear 99.9% less complaining and whining ....

as for trade unions I still think those are needed because if they went away workers would compete for jobs by lowering their wages eventually sinking back towards really low paying jobs for important work...

as for advancement I'm not talking to higher paying jobs within the union .... while I competely agree that that is a form of advancement, can you becaome a Director of a contruction company or even a vice president with just advnacement ... these are jobs in management and are very unlikely to be advanced into .... in my current position I have the ability to move up as high as I want ....

Please note that these are solely my opinions... once again arguing or saying I'm wroong will not change that it is my opinion and quite frankly I'm sticking to it, it won't change. however at the same time you are entitled to your opinion and I'm not going to try and change yours...because it is a different view point based on your experiences and I accept that


in the end there is no way to determine if unions are good or bad ... they do have good sides and they do have bad sides all that can be shared is someones experiences being in them... if you haven't been in one you really have nothing to share...IMO

PULOVR

"

Chigga1

i work in a NON-UNIONized shop,

its not bad, but then again.... they can lay anyone they want... nothing rules there at my company.....

for me ive been with my company for 6 years, ever since i was 17
i work in a machine shop.... for me to keep the company happy..

i dont talk to owners unless they talk to me.
i do the work, just leave me the F alone.
if i want to work OT, just ask me, and if im up to it, ill do it, if not.. u wont get a budge out of me...

so there are ups and downs to it.
there will always be a debate... just remember that if you work in a non unionized shop and u want to bring them in, most likely the owners will close the doors before they can enter!

coreyhayman

i think unions suck. i luv my job now....working at a golf course is the ****....work 6am-2:30pm sunday-thursday....only work 2 hrs on sundays and still they pay me for a full day, free meals made by some of the best chefs in the province, and i sit on my *** most of the day playin on the computer or cruisin the course in my golf cart (not in winter).....lol....and the pay is shweet, plus full benefits