All that and you still didn't read the last part....

I said ambiant air temp......so if it 100 degress outside, the air will be brought down a little bit less than that....ie....97-98 at least. I never said you get maracles.

As for the computer comment that EK7_DriftMania made, (which was a good one), explain why cpu chip manufactures use aluminium for thier cooling fins? Isn't the air inside the tower just as warm as the air that is blowing over the fins?

 

Did you forget that while the the air is passing through the aluminium fins, it removes the heat that has built up in the tube from the warm air passing through it?....as long as the air inside the tubes doesn't mix with the warmer outside air again, it will stay cooler....not alot, but still a bit cooler.

Newton's law of cooling states, "For a body cooling in a draft (i.e., by forced convection), the rate of heat loss is proportional to the difference in temperatures between the body and its surroundings."

Since the temperature change is proportional to the heat change.



Now, this equation never really took into account using aluminium to help speed up the cooling process.

Gee, maybe I should take my ginkgo/ginseng pills more often.

 

Hey, I know......I'll get togther with you and we'll do a test.

We will use a short air intake on a civic, and let the car heat up real good. Then do a dyno run.

then we'll put on a cold air extension (no intercooler yet), and do the dyno run again. (thier will be a gain in HP, garantied)

Then will go back to the short air again.....drive around untill it gets real hot again...bring it back, and put on the cold air extention, but this time, put on the intecooler as well. Then do the dyno again.

What do you think the numbers will indicate?

 

Everything you're talking about is conduction. Perhaps we have to clear some things up here and make it a little simpler for you guys.

As long as there is a path between two areas, heat energy moves from an area of high energy to an area of low energy until both areas equal the same heat level. In an air to air intercooler, the aluminum is the path between the heat energy of the hotter inside air and the colder outside air. Heat is transfered to the aluminum and then to the outside air. THIS DOES NOT WORK IF THE AIR OUTSIDE THE INTERCOOLER IS THE SAME TEMPERATURE AS THE AIR INSIDE THE INTERCOOLER. Aluminum is an excellent conductor, but it does not have the ability to make an intercooler greater than 100% efficiency.

You seem to be missing the highlighted part in your own equation. 'difference in temperatures'That law takes into account everything, that's why it's called a law.

If you are breathing in ambient air into the intercooler and passing ambient air over the intercooler, there is no difference in temperatures, there is no heat transfer, the air inside the intercooler receives no cooling properties.


A fan does nothing to cool your room. Take a thermometer, turn on the fan, and put the thermometer right on the breeze of the fan, there will be no change in temperature. A fan can only do two things, ciculate air so no hot spots are in the room, and cool you. You are cooled only because of the sweat and dampness on your skin. You are cooled through evaporative cooling. This is part of the concept that intercooler sprayers use to increase the effieciency of intercoolers, but unfortunately unless we're misting the intercooler with water this isn't going to help us.

See, this is conduction again. The chip is generating heat, it's hotter than the outside air, so heat is transfered from the high energy area (the chip) to the low energy area (the air). The aluminum is used to make that path as large as possible, and the fan is used to make sure the air that gets heated is pushed away so that the heat differential between the aluminum and the surrounding area is kept at it's greatest. Refering to PULOVR's quoted equation, "the rate of heat loss is proportional to the difference in temperatures between the body and its surroundings." If the hot air was alowed to stay around the chip, the heat differential between the aluminum and the air would get lower and lower and the cooling effeciency would get lower and lower.

 

Right on!

Duhh!!! I think everyone missed the whole point. If your taking in air at ambient temperature how can you make that air cooler by intercooling it through ambient temperature?

 

Look, bottom line:

Yes,
the air will cool if an intercooler is installed.

No,
you will not gain horse power because of the install on our lil D16s that don't have enough compression anyways to utilize it.

Yes,
you will indeed loose horsepower if installed on a stock D16 or any 4 banger except say a Lotus Esprit...lol...it is only effective for a turbo or supercharged vehicle.

If you want gains such as using the intercooler myth, install a Aquamist system that injects extremely fine mists of water into your throttlebody...by the time it reaches your combustion camber, it has turned itself into extremely cold air....kinda like a low budget NOS system but, without the hassles. It's a lil pricey, but, one of my add-ons soon to come...

my 2 cents.

 

No, the air will not cool any lower than the ambient air temperature with an air to air intercooler. I think I explained this pretty well in the posts above.

Static compression of the engine itself has no bearing on wether cooler air will make more power. Cooler air is more dense, it doesn't matter if you have a 6:1 or 13.5:1 compression engine, colder air has the potential to make more power.

Water Injection is a detonation control feature. It allows you to run dynamic compression and timing that you would not otherwise be able to run without it. It makes no power on it's own. The air is cooled by the evaporation of the water/alcohol in the combustion chamber. If you want power gains from a colder intake charge, your money would be better spent on one of the bottled CO2 coolers.

 

DirtyLude, you seem very knowledgable in your comments but, I've got Dyno charts to prove otherwise. And in anycase, for my application, the water injection system will prove to help gain power. Just as you've stated, by itself it may not run at it's full potential, but, in a certain application such as my project engine, it will. Thanks for you commments.

Cheers,
Buddah.

 

I like the water injection idea. It will have the same effect as higher octane would in the combustion process. It will slow the burn down. The evaporation will cool the whole deal down, and will lower emissions as well. All good things.
As with all things, you do need to have the right combo of parts to use it though. It will do squat on a 9.2:1 D-series.
I'd be very interested in seeing your plans, Buddah. Sounds, uhhh...cool.

 

Good luck with it.

And I mean that in a real 'good luck with it' way, and not the sarcastic way it looks on it's own.